Cannabinoids remove plaque-forming Alzheimer's proteins from brain cells (2016)
salk.edu93 points by anjel 6 hours ago
93 points by anjel 6 hours ago
I only had time to skim the paper. Notably, the effect is concentration dependent and required high concentrations of THC. The chart shows it really starting in the 0.1uM range and then taking off in the 1uM range.
I don’t know what levels are achieved during normal use but I did find some studies that successfully killed a lot of hippocampal neuronal cells after 6 days at 1uM range. So the levels of THC observed in this study appear to be in the same range where things start getting really disrupted in cells.
In other words, don’t expect to replicate these results with normal recreational use.
Reminds me of this classic: https://xkcd.com/1217/
There may not be many constants in this life, especially in this day and age, but I do find it humbling that "there is always an xkcd for that" holds true.
Can't have Alzheimer's if you don't have much of a brain left.
Can you explain the joke?
If the doses of cannabis required to cure alzheimers would be high enough doses to destroy the rest of one's brain, it makes this finding not very useful, similar to the idea of curing alzheimers by destroying one's brain/
Synthetic cannaboids were also studied as a possible analgesic and at the doses required it caused brain damage. Which is honestly disappointing because a general purpose pain killer that isn't opioid based would be a miracle.
We have dozens of pain killers which are not opioid based, what do you mean? From the top of my head NSAIDs can be used, and Metamizole for example is as effective as morphium.
you got nsaids, metamizole, acetoaminophen, duolexitine. And you got a couple of more that work for neuropathic pain. The biggest problem with nsaids is that they cause bleeding and kidney failure, ulcers hence can cause stomach cancer.
Here is a site you can use too see how most pharmaco therapy is lacking.
https://pain-calculator.com/calculators/osteoarthritis-pain/
Sounds like this is more "Pouring bleach on germs kills the germs but it also kills everything else"
Too bad we've had like a half-dozen putative Alzheimer's drugs that clear amyloid beta that turn out to do nothing to slow or prevent Alzheimer's.
Actually, I think even by 2016 we already had enough phase 3 drug failures that the amyloid hypothesis was severely called into question?
That's not true. Monoclonal antibodies are on the market right now which slow the progression of the disease (by removing amyloid).
AIUI, all such results are because the FDA has given up since aduhelm and said "well, if it clears amyloid, that's as good as slowing Alzheimer's, right?" despite the actual results on Alzheimer's progression being largely negative.
For what it's worth, early statins were originally cleared based only on the evidence that they lower cholesterol without longer term studies showing a reduction in mortality. Of course there is now plenty of evidence showing statins improve overall endpoints.
This appears to be dated 2016. Did the preliminary results amount to anything?
Human trial in 2025 looks promising?
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/41160460/#:~:text=ResultsAt%...
Man, too bad weed gives me bad panic attacks. Alzheimers is the scariest disease I know so maybe if the studies pan out in time and it becomes a standard preventative, I might consider trying again.
But somehow I doubt it will be found to be that effective.
Have you tried L-theanine? I also get panic attacks with weed, but L-theanine seems to help keep them at bay.
I have tried l-theanine, didn't do anything that I could tell.
But fortunately there's a much better solution for those of us who get anxiety from weed, it's called "don't smoke weed".
I've tried everything and I still get panic attacks. I used to love smoking a small hitter about an hour before bed. I've always had insomnia and that was the one thing that actually helped me sleep. When it was illegal, I loved it. I would smoke 2 or 3 times a week just for sleep, and I was healthy and happy. . . Because sleep is important, and I never wanted to take sleeping pills because dependency.
Now that it's legal and everywhere, I just get super fun panic attacks. I'm worthless, I'm failing as a parent, everybody hates me, you know, the normal anxiety attacks. Even Charlotte's Web that's SUPER low THC gives me panic attacks.
It's like my body hates it when I'm happy? I would give anything to be able to fix this problem.
Always thought that panic attacks were caused by too low CBD in regards to THC levels.
Saw someone literally suggesting keeping a CBD vape pen just in case of a panic attack. Or a friend using it for heart palpitations.
Wasn't the amount of THC concentration in resin seen as the indicator of potency? Then that amount was hacked through selective breeding, unbeknownst that not following with a complementary increase in amount of CBD will create an anxiety causing superdrug.
I experienced it once - on a party in a country where CBD strains are legal to buy by anyone, as long as they contain ~0%THC. And high quality high THC strains can be bought at a pharmacy with a prescription.
A friend rolled a 50%/50% joint, approx 0.5g total, and we proceeded to smoke it whole, just the two of us. I was surprised you could get that high without a shadow of a paranoia.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23042808/ + https://terpenebeltfarms.com/blogs/indica-vs-sativa-terpenes... gives a good picture, but yeah you're generally correct.
In legal states in the US it’s fairly easy to find commercial 1:1 THC:CBD products, among a litany of mega-potent THC-only options.
I never particularly cared for cannabis in general in the past–it didn’t give me panic attacks, but even a little bit made me feel kind of on edge. The 1:1 stuff is dramatically more pleasant.
Weed started doing the same thing to me in my mid to late 20s. What used to be relaxing suddenly turned into anxiety and negative thought spirals.
A couple years ago (around 40) I started taking a low dose antidepressant for unrelated reasons and noticed that the weed induced anxiety mostly disappeared. My guess is that for some people there’s a serotonin/anxiety component that THC can amplify, but that’s just speculation on my part.
Not suggesting antidepressants as a solution by themselves. They come with their own tradeoffs and I wouldn’t take them just for that. But it has been a pleasant side effect I didn’t expect.
Wow, Charlottes Web is such unique strain. I'm always on another planet no matter what the THC is advertised.
I feel like that strain is for EXPERTS. You can always mold it to the vibe you are aiming to reach in that present (ofc in the appropriate environments).
Do you feel like the anxiety just the cascaded result of ... "poor planning" over an extended, day-over-day staggering, sleep-deprived, period of time? I consider my self naturally the poorest of poor planners. My brain is just RAM with zero cache that i always imagine that I have. I've had weeks wiz by if I do not get on top of a fun, MJ propagandized base routine / schedule in place.
Apologies! Worse case, this could just be a swing and a miss. Empathies attempted.
I also get what I would describe as "near" panic attacks when I smoke (about once every two weeks, with friends). I realised that after about 15 minutes or so it cools down and I feel, perhaps, more relaxed than before I started. Purely anecdotal but I feel you. Maybe a bit of cooldown and good company helps with the paranoia.
How low was the % of THC in the Charlotte’s Web?
Full spectrum hemp (~0%) definitely feels like the answer, here!
So, I sort of get these from time to time, but I notice that it hits the worst when :
1. I've eaten like crap. Things too heavy I'm grease, processed food, and red meats. When I'm rating cleaner, I don't feel as panicky
2. If I feel the panic coming on, I HAVE to do some sort of aerobic exercise in that first 15 minute "induction" phase of smoking. Otherwise I'll carry the panic along through the entire session.
FWIW, YMMV
Yeah my defact is to run 5k at my pace (mild jog is fine), and just not use my screens + do not disturb mode, until i have a series of thoughts that invokes me to use my phone as a "lifeline" to quickly look up what I need to get to my next thought.
5km goes by fast! And orange juice tastes great after.
I’ve found the edible thc (gummies/drinks) you get in non-legal states are much less panic/anxiety inducing. I’m not sure why but it probably has to do with CBD or something that is missing. It’s anecdotal but I’ve noticed it a lot. They also get you very high so I’m not sure how exactly they are getting around the legality requirement.
Do we still think clearing beta amyloid plaques will halt the progress of Alzheimer's? My impression is we're treating marker for the disease and not the cause.
Not halt, but slow the progression.
https://www.nebraskamed.com/health/conditions-and-services/n...
Pro: Salk Institute Con: Preliminary Research, In Vitro
Salk? You mean the vaccine guy? /s
And also, apparently, the registered trademark?
> The researchers found that high levels of amyloid beta were associated with cellular inflammation and higher rates of neuron death. They demonstrated that exposing the cells to THC reduced amyloid beta protein levels and eliminated the inflammatory response from the nerve cells caused by the protein, thereby allowing the nerve cells to survive.
There was another recent study showing that THC was creating false short term memories - like "I swear I told you that" - but never did.
Cannabis really needs a lot more study.
There was another recent study showing that THC was creating false short term memories - like "I swear I told you that" - but never did.
Anecdotally, when I'm feeling scattered and foggy, when I take a big hit off of my vape pen, I go through a period of noticing how shaky my appendages are, and go through what feels like a physical process of the sensation of my mind "unwrinkling" or unfurling. I often wondered if something was being cleaned out in my brain because I usually feel a lot more calm and still afterward, thoughts more collected.
There are easily hundreds of compounds that can reduce beta-amyloid in vitro. This is a decade-old nothingburger.
And yet, has anyone ever claimed regular marijuana use improved their memory?
Ok fine, I'll chime in.
No, it has not improved my memory. Though, I am not really certain anything does. At least, not permanently. Though, I will say the effects on memory are rather complex. Some diminished abilities in some domains, but oddly some enhancements in a select few domains.
I am 'neurodivergent' apparently, so my experiences might not be worth much.
Get stupid now to avoid cognitive decline later? Not sure I like that tradeoff...
One adapts to it over time like any other state. Homeostasis is a blessing and a curse.
[flagged]
“Don't post generated comments or AI-edited comments. HN is for conversation between humans.”
Remove them and replace them with...Doritos?
I seem to have touched a nerve.
In my defense, it may have been a stupid joke but it's not as stupid as trying to prevent brain damage by taking cannabinoids at levels known to cause brain damage.
They can’t all be winners, right?
Here. Take my upvotes to balance it out a smidge.